Buck Angel: Staying in Control
Part Two of Two-Part Interview
Part 1 of a 2-part interview. Be sure to also read: Buck Angel: Talking Trans
HOOK: Did you ever escort? Did you ever make additional money on the side in ways other than film?
Buck: Yes, I did escort. To be honest with you, I don’t like it. It’s way more work than making a porn, as far as I’m concerned. It’s just a lot of work to be out there answering calls, blah blah blah , meeting someone. The thing in the back of my head is, “Is this guy a total freak?” In the sense, am I going to get my throat slit? Because I’m a man with a pussy. It’s not like I’m just a dude coming up and we’re going to fuck. I’m a little unique so maybe this person is going to trick me and have a bunch of his dude friends there and gangbang rape me. It could be a bad situation. So I just felt like it wasn’t worth me putting myself in that situation anymore.
HOOK: Not many guys really refer to the physical threat as being a factor with an escort. A lot of them don’t perceive it as a big issue, they figure it in. Do you think that has to do with in terms of coming at it from an FTM standpoint? That you are more worried in terms of physical harm, like physical harm somehow is more of a context for you.
Buck: Of course it is. That’s exactly why it is. With the guys, they’ll go and fuck in the park. It’s a different situation. Of course, for guys like myself, I get death threats from people. I get people telling me shit all the time that they’re going to kill me if they see me. If they find me on an escort site, who knows that they’re not going to try to trick me into going into some situation? I’m kind of guy that tends to err on the safe side and not really put myself in a situation, because I don’t have to. I can do live webcam shows and make good money. I can do those kind of things. I can make my movies. I can do the things that I do now, which is speaking and traveling the world and making money that way. I don’t have to put myself in that kind of a situation. I feel lucky.
HOOK: Are the threats coming more from heterosexuals or are they coming from gay men as well?
Buck: No, hetero guys. Gay men love me. [laughter]
HOOK: You’ve never had really any issues in terms of talking to gay men.
Buck: Oh, of course I do. There’s a ton of gay men who hate me, but they don’t seem to be violent. They’re just like, “You’re a fucking freak,” or, “You’re not gay,” or, “You’re a woman.” They’re just the ones that are scared of themselves, and they’re scared of their own stuff. I know that and I’m way ahead of that. People who lash out with that ugly stuff are really not secure in their own stuff and their own sexuality. It’s really sad to me that gay men would lash out or gay men lash out on the board. If someone says something, they’re into my movies, and then they’re like, “That’s sick. You’re not gay.” But, really, it’s just ridiculous since, being gay, you already get so much bullshit to lash out about that. It just seems strange that a gay guy wouldn’t think about what he’s saying before he says that.
HOOK: What are ways that gay men can better understand? Are there things that you would say like, “Here are three things to keep in mind and get your head out of your ass”?
Buck: Of course. One being, “Remember when people said shit to you? Not everything is black and white. First off, sexuality is not black and white. You should know better than that. What if you like to do sucking on toes but your gay buddy thinks that that’s weird and you don’t want to tell him?” Come on, it’s pretty simple. The thing is, they can’t get their head around my vagina. They can’t get their head around the vagina! Because, again, everyone’s been programmed to say a woman has a vagina and a man has a penis. Gay men are programmed just the same. It’s their own fears and their own stuff that they have around their own sexuality. They just need to open their minds a little bit more and just stop lashing out at something that they don’t understand really.
HOOK: Is one of the benefits then of, if you will, the democratization of porn that you’re able to build a empire, to be able to build your business, and build up a fan base that is responsive to what you have?
Buck: Of course! That’s the other great thing is really being able to take something and mold it into what you want it to be. That’s how I started my stuff. I didn’t know who was going to like my work. So what I did is I made three different kinds of kinds of films, one with me and women and one with me with men and women and one with me with all men. The one with all men exploded. I was like, “There it is! Gay men…”
HOOK: Why do you think it did better with gay men financially?
Buck: Because, look, I’m a dude, right? I’m having really hot, nasty gay sex with another guy. They’re pounding my hole, because it’s just a hole. I think it was fascinating to these guys. After that, I have guys write me all the time saying how they’ve always fantasized about a man with a pussy. Can you imagine? They never could say that to anybody because they would think that their friends would think it was fucking weird. Or guys write me they’ve always wanted to be a man with a pussy but they could never say it. Now, they have something that they could say, “That’s what I want to be like.” I didn’t know that was going to happen. I’ll be honest with you. I never in a million years would think that things that happened to me along the way of my work, would ever have happened. I just wanted to make porn.
HOOK: You have a wife, right? How long have you guys been together?
Buck: Ten years.
HOOK: That’s a long time. How do you two negotiate your work within the business?
Buck: Without my wife, I wouldn’t be doing my work. I came to her with the idea and I said, “Elaine, I have this idea.” Because I was making this transwoman website and I was like, “Holy shit! There’s no men, transsexual men in porn! How is that possible?” Blah, blah blah. Then I said, “I have this idea, Elaine. You’re going to think I’m weird maybe. It’s just an idea. The man with the pussy.” I’ll never forget. She said to me, “Oh my god. Buck, you have to do that. You will change the world.” She said that to me. I was like, “Come on, Elaine. It’s just porn.I’m not reinventing…” I’m telling you she was right on. She encouraged me 100 percent. She was in a couple of my first films, because I couldn’t find anybody to shoot with. She helped financially in the beginning. Without her, this would not be here. She’s a partner of mine in the business.
Pretty much in the beginning, there were times I wanted to stop because I wasn’t the person I am now and I didn’t have the thick skin or the understanding of how people lash out. So I took a lot of things personally, like when people called me names. The transmale community was ugly to me. They were like, “You fucking asshole, you’re fucking up the community.”
I was getting really fucking pissed about the whole thing. She’s like, “Nope, you have to do it. You just have to forget those people and focus.” She kept me on track. She’s 100 percent part of this business and I wouldn’t be here without her.
HOOK: Do you distinguish your sex that is part of work and your sex with her?
Buck: It’s totally two different things. That’s the reason why we could do it, because she’s a sex hog like I am. [laughter]
I wouldn’t have a wife who wasn’t a pig. She’s like a gay man. The thing is, I know she’s a woman, but she’s her. I’m attracted to her as a person. It’s not really her gender. If she was a man, I would have married her. It’s just we had a really good connection. She’s got a high sex drive and she’s very sexually focused and she’s not jealous. We’ve been together for 10 years. We know. We have it down. We’re so awesome. I’m very lucky. There’s not a lot of people who’ve been with their partners as long as I have who’re in the industry, who can say the things I can say about my partner.
HOOK: I guess that brings me to two things. One is on the practical side, how were the neighbors when you moved in? Do they know?
Buck: I live in a pueblo, which is sort of like a village. It has dirt roads and they ride horses and it’s very old school. I bought a big, big piece of property. My wife and I are tattooed and whatever. They just think we’re this straight couple that’s tattooed and we sell drugs. Of course we had to tell them, “No.”
My wife Elaine is a very famous body piercer, so she talks about her work. I just say that I make films. But the woman who works for me, I had to be totally out about it. I had to say, “I used to be a woman, and now I’m a man, and I make pornography.” She was like, “I don’t care! You’re the man of the house. I respect you.” Let me tell you, in America, they probably would have walked out on us.
Buck: It’s different here. They love us. We are very giving to the neighborhood. We do lots of awesome things here because we love being here! We have money and they don’t, and we contribute here a lot because we want to. It’s something that we really enjoy being a part of. The kids, for Christmas, we throw Christmas parties and Halloween parties. We do lots of cool stuff
HOOK: Obviously that stigma can be pretty debilitating for a lot of people. I am sure you’re aware in the last six months, we’ve had some very sad losses in the community. People who have taken their own lives. I mean, how do you process that, like how do you see that? It’s nothing new. I mean I hate when people pretend like it’s something new. I mean it’s been going on for many, many years. How do you process that? You’ve been in the industry for a long time, you said that your selfesteem, you said for a long time, it’s very fragile. Can you address a little bit about how that’s impacted you?
Buck: Well, I’m shocked! When I see stuff like that, I am shocked. Why does that happen and I don’t even know all of the story, one of them, they couldn’t to be married, right? I think it’s some was depression. I think it’s different from myself because I make my own films, and I am in control of my own destiny and I am in control. I wonder if it’s much harder that you always have to be looking for work and wonder where’s your next job going to come from.
I am very lucky because I don’t have to really worry about that. I have done all my own stuff and I work for myself and I have my own company. It makes me sad because I wish that they could have reached out. Maybe to somebody like myself.
And maybe I could have motivated them to do something for themselves, like, “Dude make your own website.” I do that all the time for people. People write to me all the time. How do I do it? This is how you do it. You do this, you teach. I didn’t even graduate high school, dude. I taught myself how to do everything. I like, “Dude, if I can do it, you can do it.”